Engine removal

[CharlieM3.8S]

Well time for the Big Nasty! The recent development of a piston-rod knocking has determined that it’s time for a engine/transmission removal and a complete engine rebuild.
Oh well, at least timing is good with winter coming on. It will be nice to have her back on the road for spring. At least that’s my plans anyway.
Does anybody have an idea what is the vertical lifting-height needed for the hoist to lift the units free from the car on a top lift scenario? I understand that the engine/transmission can be removed either from the top or from underneath, the latter requiring removal of the front-end lower unit. I also understand that it’s more or less a matter of preference whether one chooses to remove from the top or the bottom. Is that correct?
Seeing that my shop has nice high ceilings of 12 ft, and since I’ve removed three other, (non Jaguar) engines in my life, all from the top, I am planning on removing this engine from the top.
My main question is how much vertical lift is adequate? I have access to a free, loaner hydraulic boom lift, which are great things but can come up a little short sometimes in the lifting-height department. I’m trying to avoid an awkward situation where I’m sitting there with a swinging engine hanging in the air and not enough clearance to roll the car out from under it!
I can use a chain hoist if I need to, but that won’t be free.
Thanks in advance for your feedback.
Charlie

[cass3958]

Not sure on a height that has to be achieved. I took my engine out the top but was not that interested in a clean lift as the car was a wreck and being stripped for a restoration but when I put the engine back in with all the paint work done well let's say I was very careful. The height you lift the engine can depend on how close you chain the lift to the top of the head. I have lifting brackets on the cylinder head bolts that I used but with the lifting tilt rig. The arm of the hoist was between 9 and 12 inches above the engine head height so this could have been reduced to allow more lifting height. The tilting frame is a good investment as it allows you to tilt the back of the engine down to get the gearbox into the tunnel before leveling the whole lot back up and onto the mounts.

It might also depend on whether you are lifting the engine alone or taking out the engine with gearbox attached. Whether you go out the top or out the bottom again depends on what you have taken off the engine. If it's just the block and head without carbs, manifolds and ancillaries then go out the bottom.

Attached is a photo of the rig I used. Sorry I do not have a photo of the engine perched over the top of the front grill but I did not feel that was a good time to stop what I was doing to get a photo.

[Glyn Ruck]

You should have no issues with a standard engine crane. We went in from the top gearbox & OD attached. Just required me to act as ballast on the crane. You just need someone under the car to guide things and make sure that the gearbox/OD tail shaft does not knock hell out of the firewall. You require a slip point on your lifting harness to easily vary tilt. We did not require to fit the Jaguar lifting plate as my engine already had the lifting hoops attached as standard. Cass has a very sophisticated tilting device. We simply had a belt running through a triangulated hoop as you can see. Worked fine.

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[CharlieM3.8S]

What GREAT information! Thanks for all that feedback, y’all, (just my Kentucky upbringing coming out).
Charlie

[Glyn Ruck]

Sorry ~ like Cass I do not have a picture of the engine & gearbox dangling over the top of the grill. There were only 3 of us and the engine & transmission is heavy on these cars. I was required as ballast on the back of the crane ~ not taking pics. One operating the crane & the other under the car.

[cass3958]

I did it with just two of us in a small workshop. We opened the doors and rolled the chassis out, set the engine on the hoist and jacked it up. When we thought it was high enough we pushed the rolling chassis back under the engine. Even with the the hoist at full height the bottom of the sump only just went over the top of the grill and then we quickly lowered it down into position. The engine is so heavy with the gearbox attached that we would have struggled to push the engine on the hoist safely over the car. Better to move the car on nice big rubber tyres than try to push the hoist with small metal wheels over a corrugated concrete floor.


A tip doing it this way if you do not get enough height on the hoist to get the engine over the grill you can always let some air out of the front tyres to lower the front of the car. Another tip if you are pushing the engine over the car rather than the way I did it is to remove the front wheels altogether and lower the front of the car down on a jack so it sits on some very low blocks or axle stands. You could even sit the front of the car on a pair of wheels without any tyres fitted. Either way once the engine is in place you just inflate the tyres or jack up the car and replace the wheels.

[Glyn Ruck]

Excuse the pre cleaning dust. My car was on axle stands at the jacking points for easy access from below. Fortunately the little metal castors on the crane moved reasonably on our floor. I think we were close to the limits of our engine crane thus needing some ballast. Like you I also worked in multiple locations Cass. Long story.

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[John Quilter]

I recently had a complete engine overhaul done on my 3.8S at a local well regarded British car shop. After much experience, they do not try to remove engines on these cars and Mark IIs from above. They remove the complete front subframe, with wheels and tires attached, roll it out from under the car, and lower the complete power train out the bottom. It requires removal of the carbs as I recall and maybe the generator/PS pump and they tie back the two manifolds attached to the exhaust system. I do not think they even removed the radiator, just the shroud. I was amazed that they had this all done within a day of me dropping off the car. I should have stuck around and watched. Admittedly they have a lift and I think some sort of platform that can be raised to drop the engine onto. Because the engine project was going to take some considerable time and they did not want the car taking up space in their shop, they replaced the subframe, flatted bedded the car back to my garage which gave me the opportunity to fully clean and detail the entire engine bay. Not a concours job but far better than before. The car is now all back together with rebuilt engine, new diaphragm clutch, slave cylinder, updated rear main seal, new water pump, overhauled starter, generator, carbs and, new brake booster (old one was determined to have a small vacuum leak) resealed gearbox/overdrive and and the car is running like new.

[cass3958]

Taking the engine out the bottom is an option but as you said you would have to remove the carbs from one side, the dynamo, PAS pump and exhaust manifold from the other. Problem with this is having taken my carbs off the car with the engine in situ I know how hard that is. You need very slim, long arms that can bend half way along the forearm. It is a bitch of a job with the limited space in the engine bay so I found it easier out of the top with all the ancillaries still attached to the engine. Either way, top or bottom is not an afternoon job for one man in a single garage though.

[Glyn Ruck]

We had the choice of going in top or bottom but my rebuilt engine was returned fully built up carbs, manifolds & all. All we removed was the fan (Cass you have the newer nose parts giving you a little more space up front.

Also you need the right lifting equipment for the body. It is very easy to damage a newly repainted & polished body shell. So we decided engine & transmission from the top & rear bridge piece/suspension & front subframe from below. Body unmarked above or below.

During reassembly.

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